The Sims 4 was originally announced on May 6, 2013, and was released in North America on September 2, 2014 for Microsoft Windows. A Mac compatible version of the game was made available for digital download on February 17, 2015. The Sims 4 is the first PC game to top all-format charts in two years. The game has received mixed reviews since its release, with the majority of criticism directed towards its lack of content.
As March 2021, were released 10 expansion packs, 10 game packs, 18 stuff packs and 3 kits. The fact that first kit is codenamed SP20 while last stuff pack is SP18 indicate that a 19th stuff pack is expected to come in 2021 which may be LAST pack for The Sims 4. The Sims 5 will come in late 2021 or 2022!
Review by Teoalida
When I initially wrote this review, I wrote based on other people reviews, because did not had the change to get the game for free download and make it working. I am NOT going to pay even $1 for such bad game, I wanted to get it for free, play few hours to review it, then delete, because I cannot play it anyway, I have grown up, becoming an adult and a busy businessman so I no longer have time for gaming. I am sorry for all kids who wasted $60 for this piece of shit.
I played it in 2015 when EA offered the game for free play for 48 hours starting from the moment you download it, and improved the review.
The Sims 4 is the WORST game of Sims series, or second worst after the original The Sims game launched in 2000 (it being the first Sims game, is understandable why it was a bad game, but for a 2014 game is simply unacceptable to be so bad).
Electronic Arts made a huge step backwards in October 2014. Lots of features available in The Sims 2 and 3 base games do not exist in The Sims 4 base game.
- The Sims 4 worlds are small, up to 20 lots, compared with 70-100 lots in The Sims 3. All lots are fixed on screen, a cartoon-style 2D map like in The Sims 1. You cannot rotate camera around the neighborhood. You cannot move houses from one lot to another.
- The open concept from The Sims 3 is gone. You live in a neighborhood with max 5 playable houses on a background full of houses that you cannot touch. travelling between neighborhoods is possible but bring the loading screen like in The Sims 2.
- The pools do not exist in base game. Do you notice that 90% of the houses I built in The Sims 2 and 3 have pools? I can’t live in a house without a pool. The pool feature was introduced in a patch launched one month later, but… all worlds launched for The Sims 3 are compatible with base game, so this does mean that possible new worlds that will be provided for The Sims 4 will feature only houses without pool? Horrible!
- The owned cars or garages do not exist in base game and is unlikely to have them added by any expansion. With such small worlds and limited build mode you have nothing to do with a car. Cars that take sim to work, famous in previous 3 games, also do not exist, the sim simply go in front of house and disappear.
- Toddler life stage is also removed. Not a big deal in my opinion but many people loved them (toddlers added via a free update in 2017).
- The Sims 4 does not include emergency services, you cannot call police 911 because there are no burglars (many people hated having their homes robbed but personally I found funny to see burglars from time to time), worse than this, fire services are missing too, putting a fire detector is pointless and in case you burn the stove you need to extinguish fire with your own Sims. Gardener services also does not exist.
- Workplaces and school are not existent in The Sims 4 as we know them in The Sims 3. It returns to The Sims 1 / 2 style, the sim goes in front of house and disappears, there is not even a car or school bus to take the sim to work, you do not see where it is going.
- The Sims 4 graphics are not significantly improved compared with The Sims 3, or even worse, the grass and water were well textured in The Sims 3 while in The Sims 4 looks plain.
- Create a Style from The Sims 3 was also removed. You can no longer apply custom colors to objects, you need to choose from a predefined list of colors as you did in The Sims 2.
- The Sims 4 do not have a pre-made story.
The Sims 4 build mode was redesigned to allow easier construction of houses, but it prevents you from exploring architecture creativity:
- You can buy pre-furnished rooms and arrange them to form a floorplan, doors are automatically added between rooms but sometimes in wrong place.
- You can drag walls to resize the rooms without having to remove items hanged on wall. If the wall you move overlaps with furniture placed in the room, the furniture is automatically removed, but you can undo.
- The Sims 4 houses can have 4 floors above ground and 2 basement floor (under ground).
- Each floor can have 3 heights, short, medium, tall, 12, 16, 20 stair steps, 4 steps per horizontal square meaning 9 inch tread. Floor heights are approximately 9, 12, 15 feet, meaning that staircases have 9 inch riser, making them at 45-degree, steeper than in previous games and unrealistic, violating architectural codes from real life. For comparison in The Sims 1 / 2 / 3 the floors had a height of 16 steps with an apparent height of 10 feet, giving a riser of 7.5 inch. Most pre-build houses have medium wall height, making oversized ceiling height in my opinion. Tall walls are required to add cornices under roof, an useless feature in my opinion. You can change wall height anytime, but lowering the height will make tall windows to disappear.
- The foundation is added automatically when you build the first floor, and you can anytime adjust basement height from 0 to 9 steps, stair length is adjusted automatically.
- You cannot make houses raised on foundation and garage without foundation on same lot. You cannot have semi-basements integrated in foundation on sloped land, as it was possible in The Sims 2 and 3.
Other facts:
- The Sims 4 support all 16:9 resolutions up to 2560×1440 (QHD). Good, considering that The Sims 3 lacked FULL HD (1920×1080) support and was running at maximum of 1600… 1600×900 and 1600×1200 (update: figured later that you can edit GraphicRules.sgr to set up custom resolutions, FULL HD and 4K works fine).
- The life simulation was slightly improved over The Sims 3. This is the only good thing that survived from all The Sims series.
Lot prices in Newcrest
- 15×20 – $1500
- 20×30 – $2000
- 20×40 – $2500
- 30×30 – $2500
- 30×40 – $3000
- 40×50 – $8500
Willow Creek and Oasis Spring have lot prices varying between lots of same size.
The Sims 4 expansion packs (from Wikipedia)
EP01 Get to Work
PC: NA: March 31, 2015; EU: April 2, 2015.
Console: WW: March 20, 2018.
The first expansion pack adds three new playable, active careers: Doctor, Detective and Scientist. Get to Work also gives the opportunity to build your own retail store and start your own retail business. The expansion pack also adds a new neighborhood called Magnolia Promenade, and planet Sixam, an alien home world, as well as playable alien Sims. It also adds two new skills (Baking and Photography), new objects and clothing.
EP02 Get Together
PC: NA: December 8, 2015; EU: December 10, 2015.
Console: WW: September 11, 2018.
Get Together is the second expansion pack for The Sims 4, which was announced on August 5, 2015 at Gamescom. The main new feature of this expansion pack is Clubs. The player can create and join Clubs with distinct interests, personalities, and styles where the player can set the rules, define their look, and customize their hangouts. Furthermore, there are brand new activities such as foosball, darts, Don’t Wake The Llama and arcade machine. There are also all new DJ & Dancing skills. This expansion pack features a new world of called Windenburg, with scenic neighborhoods and picturesque landmarks, including the sprawling hedge maze at the Von Haunt Estate, the alluring pools along the bluffs, and the mysterious ancient ruins. Other new features include: emotional texts, natural pool colours, new foods & drinks, barista & DJ NPCs, and new Closet WooHoo & Bush WooHoo.
EP03 City Living
PC: NA: November 1, 2016; EU: November 3, 2016.
Console: WW: November 14, 2017.
The third expansion pack features a new city called San Myshuno with four unique neighborhoods. City Living introduces new careers reflective of our time including the returning politician career and two new brand new fields never seen in the franchise: social media and critic. The expansion pack focuses on city life and reintroduces apartments into the city, ranging from fixer-uppers to penthouses. There are many new lots and activities for Sims to explore such the Spice Market, Karaoke Bar, Geek Con with video game competitions, the Spice Festival with curry eating contests and a Romance Festival for love-seeking Sims. Apartments will feature lot traits which can be assigned to any lot. The new lot traits are available via patch to players who do not purchase the expansion.
EP04 Cats & Dogs
PC: WW: November 10, 2017.
Console: WW: July 31, 2018.
The fourth expansion pack introduces creation of pets such as cats, dogs, and items catered to Sims’ furry friends (similar to The Sims 2: Pets, The Sims 3: Pets and The Sims: Unleashed). This also allows players to pursue a veterinary career and create their own veterinary practice.
EP05 Seasons
PC: WW: June 22, 2018.
Console: WW: November 13, 2018.
The fifth expansion pack introduces new weather and seasons systems similar to the systems found in The Sims 2: Seasons and The Sims 3: Seasons, which allow Sims to experience winter, spring, summer, and fall. The pack also introduces new outfits as well as a new career, the Botanist.
EP06 Get Famous
PC: WW: November 16, 2018.
Console: WW: February 12, 2019.
The sixth expansion pack allows sims to become famous (similar to The Sims: Superstar) through the addition of an acting active career or a social media influencer. A variety of expensive objects are added to create luxury mansions, in the brand new world of Del Sol Valley.
EP07 Island Living
PC: WW: June 21, 2019
Console: WW: July 16, 2019
The seventh expansion pack focuses on sims living in a tropical paradise world called Sulani (in a similar vein to that of The Sims 3: Island Paradise). Other features include the conservationist, diving, fishing and lifeguard careers, playable mermaids, boats and the island locals.
EP08 Discover University
PC: WW: November 15, 2019
Console: WW: December 17, 2019
The eighth expansion pack introduces your sims to the life of university (similar to The Sims 2: University and The Sims 3: University Life). There is a new world, Britechester, which has two universities, “University of Britechester” and “Foxbury Institute”. It also adds the possibility of riding a bike.
EP09 Eco Lifestyle
WW: June 5, 2020
The ninth expansion pack focuses on eco-friendly living and environmental changes. There is a new world, Evergreen Harbor, which is impacted the environmental choices your Sims make. New objects include solar panels and wind turbines.
EP10 Snowy Escape
WW: November 13, 2020
The tenth expansion pack focuses on winter living. There is a new world, Mt. Komorebi. Snow-inspired accessories and activities, such as snowboarding, skiing, sledding, hot springs and sanctuary-building, were also included.
EP11 Cottage Living
WW: July 22, 2021
The eleventh expansion pack focuses on village life. There is a new world, Henford-on-Bagley. Village-inspired accessories and activities, such as farming, making friends with animals, living off the land, and oversized crop competitions are also included. This expansion also marks the return of Agnes Crumplebottom to the franchise.
High School Years
WW: July 28, 2022
Introduces an active high school experience for teens, including after-school activities and prom; adds a world named Copperdale.
The Sims 4 game packs (from Wikipedia)
GP01 Outdoor Retreat
PC: WW: January 13, 2015.
Console: WW: December 4, 2018.
Adds a new world called Granite Falls. Within the new world Sims can vacation outdoors in a national park. This pack also adds a new skill (Herbalism); a new collectable (insects); and several new Sims traits, achievements, aspirations, outfits, objects, and game interactions related to outdoor activities.
GP02 Spa Day
PC: WW: July 14, 2015.
Console: WW: April 18, 2019.
Adds a new building type, the spa. This pack also includes a new skill (Wellness) as well as several new outfits, objects and game interactions related to the typical features in a spa like massages, meditation, mud baths, saunas and yoga.
GP03 Dine Out
PC: WW: June 7, 2016.
Console: WW: January 8, 2018.
Allows Sims to visit restaurants, as well as build and run their own restaurant. Those that own restaurants can experiment with new foods, employ staff and succeed in cooking. This pack also comes with a variety of items in Create a Sim.
GP04 Vampires
PC: WW: January 24, 2017.
Console: WW: November 14, 2017.
Allows Sims to become Vampires with different powers and weaknesses. A new residential world with five lots, Forgotten Hollow, is also introduced. The pack also comes with a new aspiration, new lot traits and numerous CAS and Build mode items that fit the darker Vampire theme.
GP05 Parenthood
PC: WW: May 30, 2017.
Console: WW: June 19, 2018.
Allows adult Sims to control and shape their child or teen’s life. New features like cursing, acne, school related projects, and many more. Toddlers, children, and teens can now be rebellious to their parents and other siblings. Parents can treat this new behavior by being strict, or they could be nurturing and hope that good things will come.
GP06 Jungle Adventure
PC: WW: February 27, 2018.
Console:WW: December 4, 2018.
Adds a new destination world called Selvadorada. New food, dance moves and music are added. Ancient artifacts and mysterious relics can be excavated and examined.
GP07 StrangerVille
PC: WW: February 26, 2019
Console: WW: May 14, 2019
Adds a new residential world named StrangerVille with a mystery to be solved. A new aspiration, build mode items, and CAS items were also included.
GP08 Realm of Magic
PC: WW: September 10, 2019
Console: WW: October 15, 2019
Adds two new worlds, Glimmerbrook and the Magical Realm. Adds Spellcasters and magical gameplay as well as Art Nouveau style build mode items and three different styles of Spellcaster CAS items.
GP09 Star Wars™: Journey to Batuu
WW: September 8, 2020
Adds a new destination world called Batuu with a Star Wars-style storyline. Adds new types of aliens and other Star Wars-inspired outfits, objects and characters.
GP10 Dream Home Decorator
WW: June 1, 2021
Adds a new interior decorator active career and several new types of furniture, such as sectional seating, built-in stovetops and ovens, and toaster ovens.
My Wedding Stories
WW: February 23, 2022
Introduces a revamped wedding event system, with wedding-related events, clothes, and activities, and a world named Tartosa.
Werewolves
WW: June 16, 2022
Introduces werewolf Sims, and a world named Moonwood Mill.
The Sims 4 stuff packs (from Wikipedia)
SP01 Luxury Party Stuff
PC: WW: May 19, 2015.
Console: WW: December 5, 2017.
Includes several luxury party outfits and items, including buffet tables and a table-top cheese/chocolate/drinking fountain.
SP02 Perfect Patio Stuff
PC: WW: June 16, 2015.
Console: WW: November 17, 2017.
Includes patio furniture, including hot tubs, as well as new outfits.
SP03 Cool Kitchen Stuff
PC: WW: August 11, 2015.
Console:WW: December 5, 2017.
Includes kitchen counters, cabinets and appliances, such as an Ice Cream Maker with over 30 different flavors.
SP04 Spooky Stuff
PC: WW: September 29, 2015.
Console: WW: October 2, 2018.
Includes Halloween-related costumes, items including spider webs and a pumpkin carving station, and a new spooky-themed party that Sims can throw.
SP05 Movie Hangout Stuff
PC: WW: January 12, 2016.
Console: WW: February 19, 2019.
Includes Bohemian-styled clothing, home theaters, and items such as the Popcorn Maker.
SP06 Romantic Garden Stuff
PC: WW: February 9, 2016.
Console: WW: February 6, 2018.
Includes garden objects, new outfits, and new gameplay modes.
SP07 Kids Room Stuff
PC: WW: June 28, 2016.
Console: WW: June 19, 2018.
Includes items for children’s rooms, including new beds, a puppetry, a new game, and new hair and clothes for children.
SP08 Backyard Stuff
PC: WW: July 19, 2016.
Console: WW: May 22, 2018.
Includes items for the backyard such as slip ‘n’ slide and bird feeders, and new hair and clothes.
SP09 Vintage Glamour Stuff
PC: WW: December 6, 2016.
Console: WW: November 14, 2017.
Includes vintage style items such as a vanity table, new Old Hollywood inspired clothes and hair and the ability to hire a butler.
SP10 Bowling Night Stuff
PC: WW: March 29, 2017.
Console: WW: March 12, 2019.
Includes items such as bowling lanes allowing players to build their own bowling hangout(s) for their Sims to visit. A new five level bowling skill, new themed clothing items, furniture, wallpapers and floorings are also included.
SP11 Fitness Stuff
PC: WW: June 20, 2017.
Console: WW: March 12, 2019.
Includes new items such as the rock climbing treadmill, workout videos and earbuds. Also included are more fitness apparel.
SP12 Toddler Stuff
PC: WW: August 24, 2017.
Console: WW: May 22, 2018.
Includes new playground equipments for toddlers to use.
SP13 Laundry Day Stuff
PC: WW: January 16, 2018.
Console: WW: August 14, 2018.
Includes new home technologies to help your Sim with domestic responsibilities and live an eco-friendly life. Marks of the return of laundry, washing machines and other laundry related items.
SP14 My First Pet Stuff
PC: WW: March 13, 2018.
Includes hamster, rat, pygmy hedgehog, or miniature bubalus as new pets. It is the first stuff pack to require another piece of Downloadable Content in order to use some of the content in it, in this case the Cats and Dogs pack.
SP15 Moschino Stuff
PC: WW: August 13, 2019
Console: WW: September 3, 2019
New clothing and décor from Moschino and Freelance Fashion Photographer career.
SP16 Tiny Living Stuff
PC: WW: January 21, 2020
Console: WW: February 4, 2020
Includes new home technologies to help your Sim with living a smaller lifestyle and reducing his/her carbon footprint., including carbon neutral tiles and Murphy beds.
SP17 Nifty Knitting Stuff
WW: July 28, 2020
Introduces a brand-new knitting system and skill in which you can knit clothing for your Sims and sell knitted objects on an in-game craft-sharing online store, Plopsy. Also marks the return of rocking chairs to the franchise. Includes two new radio stations: Focus and Metal.
SP18 Paranormal Stuff
WW: January 26, 2021
Introduction of the medium skill, the paranormal investigator freelance branch, haunted houses and as the return of Bonehilda to the franchise.
Kits
SP20 Throwback Fit Kit
WW: March 2, 2021
90’s-inspired athletic clothing.
SP21 Country Kitchen Kit
WW: March 2, 2021
Country-style kitchen objects and decorations.
SP22 Bust The Dust Kit
WW: March 2, 2021
Vacuum cleaners and dust system.
SP23 Courtyard Oasis Kit
WW: May 18, 2021
Moroccan-style decor for home center.
Industrial Loft Kit
WW: August 26, 2021
Brooklyn-inspired industrial loft decor.
Fashion Street Kit
WW: October 5, 2021
Mumbai-inspired clothing and jewelry
Incheon Arrivals Kit
WW: October 5, 2021
Seoul-inspired contemporary fashion.
Blooming Rooms Kit
WW: November 9, 2021
Indoor plants and greenery for home interiors.
Modern Menswear Kit
WW: December 2, 2021
Modern fashion for male Sims, in collaboration with British menswear designer Stefan Cooke, and British Fashion Council.
Most people love this game and it really interesting game and reviews of this game very positive.
notresponding.net
I disagree. It’s a buggy mess. They don’t even care to fix the game. They’re just sitting in their ivory towers coming up with their evil schemes on how to rip off their consumers. Well, no more of this BS! This cybercop is about to issue a warrant against the biggest griefers. Electronic Arts. And I really wish that stupid red squiggly line would stop underlining the words because they make me think I misspelled it. It is too a word, dammit! Look it up online after you’re finished rekking another player in an online tournament.
Why do you have to be so mean. They worked hard on the game and they added so many interesting features!
The initial comment is actually a SPAMMER, a bot posting generic positive comments on random websites for solo purpose of having a link to his website. And The Sims 4 have far less “interesting features” than Sims 2 and 3.
NALA28, next time don’t message via chat IF you don’t need help. You made me to leave bathroom and go to computer for NO REASON, you closed chat faster than I could answer.
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I swear to God if Sims 4 gets deleted I will haunt you. What about the people who actually enjoy Sims and don’t want to get it deleted just because you and some other are mad?! Do you know how easy it is to fix your problem if not i’ll tell you, all you have to do is don’t play the game! It’s not hard at all and do you know how difficult it is to make a game? I don’t think so. So I actually appreciate the developers for taking their time to make a game and deal with people like you. Did you know that Sims was created was created because someone lost their home in the Oakland firestorm in 1991. Yeah so this game actually means a lot to some people and its maybe something that’s cheer’s them up. For example I have fun creating new people and basically controlling them. Sorry if I came off rude but if its a big deal just dont play the game and leave it alone because they’re are plenty other games that has issues so don’t act like Sims is the worst game ever because its really not. And Again sorry and the first sentence I didn’t mean it and you can see how much Sims means to me and other people so please just dont.
are you trying to put are virus on peoples computer
I agree. And though I literally spent over $1,000 on all the DLCs, the updates and everything else in between, this game is still a diarrhetic mess! I’m not even joking, this game is so bad, it’s not even close to the “so bad, it’s good” category. The Star Wars pack is horrible, and nobody wanted it, Building is tedious, sims not doing what you want them to do, constant crashes, all that makes me wanna take my car and crash it into EA’s headquarters. Oh, wait! There’s no cars in this game wither! Oh, well. Better start playing every single car game to fantasize on EA’s demise. But not Need for Speed since EA destroyed that franchise too.
By the way, when I typed wither, I meant to type either. Sometimes, when I get real angry, I type real fast and tend to cause typos.
Two months later, the game still sucks! The Detective career is now the most defective career! I’ve made a joke on the EA website implying if it’s their idea of defunding the police, but that went nowhere. I can’t believe they got away with ripping people off on a broken game while people are stuck at home during this pandemic. Do yourselves a favor and start hiring attorneys and defund EA.
ispend are lot of money on thesims 4 and i couldnt download the full game
Now it crashes after leaving the build/buy mode. Thank the stars I save the game before leaving build/buy. But that doesn’t excuse the crashes. Their “So Called” idea was for gamers to buy a new XBox or PS5. I can’t even afford a new SSD let alone a 9th gen console! And to Nala28, the reason why I give negative reviews is because I’m getting tired of all the BS that EA puts all of their customers into. I cannot let a Triple-A developer get away with their crimes against gamers.
Game is still absolute garbage. 7 years of a broken, boring game. Worst game in the franchise by miles
I have to agree strongly with the review here and the criticism of this game. From my calculations I would have to spend nearly £550 for the full suite of the game, expansions and stuff packs and kits. That is a hell of a lot of money and I would be surprised if anyone has that amount of money to buy all of this and anything new they try and push down onto us.
I got one or two of the expansions and stuff packs during the summer sale on Origin but I can see now I’ve wasted £80 for nothing!
I certainly found it has gone down the same route as SimCity 2015 and just a waste of time and money!
The UI is rather confusing and not easy to navigate or use, that and it’s hard to know what my Sims needs levels are.
The buy and build modes are not any better. It’s frustrating when placing an item and not being able to rotate it with the mouse or drag it to sell.
What’s more irritating is the fact that wall items like windows are not set to the right height. Tried placing a window only to find it at the bottom! Only then to use delicate movements of the mouse to get it to the right position, and that’s not easy if you’re hands aren’t sturdy enough!
Adding a roof to a building is no easy task either. The fact they’re fixed styles means I can’t make a diagonal shaped building without the roof sticking out. Never had that problem with The Sims 3 when you had the choice of making your own roof or having one automatically added based around the shape of the building.
Also agree that the open world was better and one had more choice for making houses and community lots, and move the around before finally placing them.
I’ve played all The Sims games since the first one came out and each one has got its ups and downs.
Each one did have something unique to them, despite the old “I wish this or that from the previous game was included”. However this was just a few things that can be made possible with mods.
I can’t say that about The Sims 4. Especially since the “I wish it had this or that from the Sims 2 and 3” is more longer than the Sims 3.
Nonetheless The Sims 3 is probably the best of them all since you had more control on both ones Sims but also the world of them and the ability to build whatever one wanted for them and travel to other places. As well as giving them aspirations and life dreams to fulfil.
I can’t really say that about this new one though. If anything there’s more negatives than positives about this one.
ifeel like am the only one who is talking more about how the gbs is because dont install the sims 4 and buy it it will take are lot of gbs if you get the complete versoin just like the trush sims 3 it takes are lot of gbs and when you see other games they dont i dislike how ea keeps on making games with files that are not usefull the sims 3 trush the sims 4 almost as worst as the sims 3 the only way i will get change my mind if they stop making games that have too much gbs and expansion packs with at less 1gb or 100mb but still i think sims 4 is better but i dislike how when you install the sims 4 without packs is still much gbs if your reading this ea and if sims 5 comes out dont make the same mistake as freaking sims 4 and sims 3 at least have the full game with only 2 gbs and the installing with 4 gbs i will then be happy aslo i hope you read and i hope you know get what people think about the sims 4 thanks for reading 😊
and it took my money and i payed for it so thats why i hate both of them
@Dequan_Gambrell Agreed! The game feels so fake. Lots of objects around, but you can’t communicate with it. It’s all about “sim talking” and that’s boring. Also those location loadings are annoying, I understood it in Sims 2, but nowadays? :/ And all the additions are like separated from each other. The ONLY one good thing is graphics. Sims 3 is way better. Even “the Sims Making Magic” with those magic quests and ingredients is more interesting to play than Sims 4! Feels like Sims4 creators didn’t realize what really is important in this game. So disappointed! l will have to play Sims 3 forever, if the game will keep going that empty way..
What do you mean by “The life simulation was slightly improved over The Sims 3. This is the only good thing that survived from all The Sims series.”?
I have been playing Sims for like 2-1 years now, yes there are some things that bug me but honestly I don’t think its worth you guys getting all upset about like y’all world is over or something if its that serious don’t play the game and leave your comment out because no one cares…